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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GM
[B][SIZE=2]You're welcome, though I've never tried either the candle or smoke test, just have read of others doing them. I've always used Windex or generic equivalent as it blows nice bubbles and doesn't hurt any wood/finish I've sprayed it on
I'm sure using a liquid like Windex is a more precise test than the candle test--just like trying to find a leak in an inner tube with a liquid. Since the bottoms of the Model 19's (and 14's) are finished, I could spray some Windex there (that would be an inconspicuous test area) and leave it on there for 20-30 minutes, wipe if off and check to make sure it didn't have any adverse effect on the walnut finish before performing air leak tests on the visible portion of the cabs......
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
westend9
Those cabs are literally going to be works of art.....
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GM
If you say so, but when someone quotes me I will always assume it's directed only to me and my response........
GM
Agreed I can see how that could be mistaken.As a carpenter/contractor though I thought Lance would pick up on it(Understood what I meant), which he did. :2thumbsup:
Great Job ! Lance they have really come together really quickly.BTW Are you retired or are you not working at the moment.I never seem to have enough time to work on mine after working Full time all week.:( But with the days getting longer(daylight) this should improve. :)
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Altec Best
Agreed I can see how that could be mistaken.As a carpenter/contractor though I thought Lance would pick up on it(Understood what I meant), which he did. :2thumbsup:
Great Job ! Lance they have really came together really quickly.BTW Are you retired or are you not working at the moment.I never seem to have enough time to work on mine after working Full time all week.:( But whith the days getting longer(daylight) this should improve. :)
I understood the original intent, AB, no worries.
Currently, I'm waiting for the phone to start ringing with a host of projects that folks are needing done. It happens every Spring. I haven't built homes for a good number of years, there is too much competition and the profit margins force one into a lifestyle that I don't enjoy (constant push and dealing with more employees). About 15 yrs. ago I decided that remodeling and maintenance was a better niche to fill. I also have a few commercial customers that need occasional building maintenance services. My wife and I also operate a cleaning business but we have weened that to only a few long-held customers.
My new title, as of April 8, is "Semi-retarded", lol. I plan to start getting some of that money back that my Uncle has been holding for the past 45 years.:D Barring physical impairment, I don't think I'll ever stop building and repairing things. The Good Lord put a few "fixers" on the Planet to take care of the needs of the less skilled and I happen to be one. I like my role.
One of my newest views on aging is that it puts one's time on a razor's edge. I need to spend time on what I enjoy doing since I only have so much left and the other side is that I still have a lot of things to "fix" before I get to that Big Job Site in the sky.
Here's some construction related humor I heard a little while back:
There was a problem that developed between the Devil and St. Peter, there was a lot of mix up and waiting either at the Pearly Gates or the Pit of Damnation. Folks were either at the wrong entrance and the amount of newly departed caused a major snafu. The crisis brought St. Peter and Beelzebub to the table. "What are we going to do?", asked St. Peter. Satan thought a moment and then said,"Why not build a couple of really fast express elevators to bring the deceased to the proper destinations, I need those fire-tenders". To this, St. Peter was in agreement but knew the craft of the Hot One and asked,"Yeah, but who's going to foot the bill for all of this?" The Devil replied, "Let's split it up. We'll do it like the old days of the railroads, you start at your end and build down and I'll have my minions get building upwards". The deal was consummated and they parted.
A few weeks went by and since the Devil knew how to work his crews with zeal, he made good progress. St. Peter and the Chosen were off to a good start, too. The upward bound crews pushed harder yet and could soon see the agreed half-way meeting point but there was no sign of St. Peter and the downward building crew. "I'll have to see what's going on", said Lucifer. He gave St. Peter a call and was told, "No worries, I'll get back to you in just a bit". The devil and his crews kept moving along and had now reached the "Promontory Point" of the endeavor. "Where the home is he?" ranted the Devil. He called back to the Pearly Gates and after getting through a long pass around on the heavenly phone system, finally reached St. Peter. "Pete, what's going on? We're past the middle, here and you're nowhere in sight!". "Well,...", St. Peter replied, "I have to confess, we've run into a bit of a problem, we can't seem to find any Contractors"
Enjoy your day!
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
voice of the theater
...........and leave it on there for 20-30 minutes........
Why so long? If it's going to blow bubbles it will happen just as fast as whatever frequency the woofer's being driven at and if you're worried about any liquid damage, just sprinkle some baby powder or similar to soak it up quick and brush it off with an old paintbrush.
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
voice of the theater
Those cabs are literally going to be works of art.....
Yeah, way more time than I'm willing to devote on a speaker. I'd rather just hide mine behind screens. Now back when I did custom paint jobs on various vehicles, I didn't think twice about investing a month or more in it. If a fly landed on it and it didn't bust its a$$ sliding off, it wasn't done. Different strokes/priorities.........
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GM
Why so long? If it's going to blow bubbles it will happen just as fast as whatever frequency the woofer's being driven at and if you're worried about any liquid damage, just sprinkle some baby powder or similar to soak it up quick and brush it off with an old paintbrush.
GM
You're right--It's not like I'm going to be testing all 6 cabs at the same time--the most the Windex needs to be on any individual surface is couple of minutes or so--long enough to watch for bubbles, wipe it off, and move on to another area..... :doh:
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
voice of the theater
You're right--It's not like I'm going to be testing all 6 cabs at the same time--the most the Windex needs to be on any individual surface is couple of minutes or so--long enough to watch for bubbles, wipe it off, and move on to another area..... :doh:
I believe Altec used an oil based finish on the veneer, correct? If so, the cabs should be oblivious to water and alcohol, IIRC. GM's idea about baby shampoo and alcohol would then be the quintisenntial mix. I know Windex doesn't bubble all that well, maybe introducing a teaspoon of dishsoap or shampoo to the bottle would bring more suds. The only thing I've ever leak tested is pipes and ducts so this is all new to me.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
I spent the better part of yesterday sanding the cabinets, filling, and finishing. Nothing remarkable for this, sand with three grits, remove dust, and apply oil finish.
I had an unsightly fissure in one of the panels, the front of one cabinet, and wanted to fill this crack.I tried mixing 5 minute epoxy and sawdust reclaimed from the sanding but results were terrible. The epoxy mix was very dark, basically unsandable, and wouldn't absorb any finish. Other glues and sawdust combined for a better color but, again, sanding and finish absorbtion was not good. I was thinking of what kind of binder I could use to attain color and functionality when I remembered that flour set up quite well when mixed with water (paper mache) so I combined some dust and a little flour and hit upon a recipe of 2 parts sawdust to 1 part of flour. It worked quite well and the Tung oil is able to penetrate the mix. The filler should attain a durability identical to the rest of the wood once I have multiple coats of finish on top of it. From a couple of feet away, the crack is unnoticable.
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/04/24.jpg
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/04/25.jpg
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/04/26.jpg
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/04/27.jpg
The sleds now have four coats of finish and the cabinets will soon have two coats. We are getting close. I will spend some time, today, making up a new testing "clicker". I found an older toggle that should work well for this.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
It's not the veneer to worry about, but water blistering any exposed MDF, though if there's a leaky joint it might seal it up. Hmm, a new way to seal MDF cabs by spraying/'floating' a little water along all inside seams, he asks half seriously.
Really? I admit I haven't used genuine Windex since the store brands became available decades ago, but these bubble up good enough for me, though I guess the best would be the kid's bubble blowing solution if it's not been banned by the govt.. Google returned a DIY solution when searching for it though: http://www.zurqui.com/crinfocus/bubble/form.html
Got to try this on a so far bubble free, yet slow leaking, tire that even the local car repair/tire emporium has repeatedly failed to find, but refuse to replace as defective. Guess who won't get any more of my vehicle related sales...............
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GM
It's not the veneer to worry about, but water blistering any exposed MDF, though if there's a leaky joint it might seal it up. Hmm, a new way to seal MDF cabs by spraying/'floating' a little water along all inside seams, he asks half seriously.
Really? I admit I haven't used genuine Windex since the store brands became available decades ago, but these bubble up good enough for me, though I guess the best would be the kid's bubble blowing solution if it's not been banned by the govt.. Google returned a DIY solution when searching for it though:
http://www.zurqui.com/crinfocus/bubble/form.html
Got to try this on a so far bubble free, yet slow leaking, tire that even the local car repair/tire emporium has repeatedly failed to find, but refuse to replace as defective. Guess who won't get any more of my vehicle related sales...............
GM
I don't know, the Windex I use doesn't seem to make a lot of bubbles but I've never used it to do that. For pipe inspection, I mix a couple of teaspoons of dish soap and a pint of water in a spray bottle.
Next time you spray the tire for inspection, GM, give the inside of the rim a thorough coating, too. I've had leaks through the welds in the center of a rim a couple of times.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Just put one of these in the box and seal the port.
http://www.harbormodels.com/site08/m...ges/smoker.htm
And if you are really adventurous, pull the woofer and seal the hole with a plywood disk, put a tire valve on the plate you seal the port with and add compressed air to speed things up.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Well, stayed up late last night and put the last coat of finish on the cabinets, I was impatient to hear the setup.
I am triamping the system with a Pass F5 on the 802g/811, JBL/UREI 6290 (a beast) on either the Heils or the 416's, and a Kenwood KA-8150 switching with the JBL. I am crossing through a Behringer CX3400 at 1100 hz to the horn and at 9300hz. to the Heil. Preamp is a Yamaha C2a and source is a Yamaha DVD player. Quite a combination of gear and level matching is tricky. The garage venue is pitiful for sound stage and all else but, man, what a sound.
The presentation of the low end in the MLTL is nicely balanced and there seems to be no bottom. It is very smooth but can pound your chest, too. It is heads above the stock Model 19 box. I'm throwing a lot of different material at it and everything is good. It is like moving from the back of the crowd at a concert to being right up front. GM, you are a genius. Thanks so much, this is a total success.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
I've kind of settled into a good listening schedule with the new boxes and have fiddled around with level matching and such. Also had a few visitors that confirmed we're on a good track with these. I even had my old buddy, Harry, in the room for a while. This is a cat that is over 90 and still recalls a lot of his speaker building days. To him, Sinatra was an upstart, funny stuff.
The woofers have seemed to break back in and other listeners have confirmed this. This is no surprise as I had them in storage for a couple of years. I think I can get the lower end a little "livlier" by removing some of the stuffing. I think it is a little too much for the application. I plan to remove about half the thickness and see if there is any change. I hope to get a little more reinforcement of the really low stuff by doing so. More of what's already present, I guess. Any suggestions appreciated on the stuffing.
Overall, the enclosures are very good, lower notes are reproduced substantially and the venerable 416b is allowed to shine. A board member suggested to get some measurement gear and that is on the schedule. I am weighing options on that.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
westend9
............. A board member suggested to get some measurement gear and that is on the schedule. I am weighing options on that.
You also can test the enclosures with your ears, with this CD http://amzn.to/ebCGnn
And of course, and that's very important; only testing in your listening room!!!
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
AltecLansingFan
You also can test the enclosures with your ears, with this CD
http://amzn.to/ebCGnn
And of course, and that's very important; only testing in your listening room!!!
Thanks, I'll get it coming my way.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
westend9
Thanks, I'll get it coming my way.
I think it's track 18, 19 and 20 (I'm not really sure) There you can hear all Hz from 10Hz and up. The best is that you can hear almost NO or less volume peaks in the frequency's.
I'm not an expert, but when I look to the enclosure, the briefcase vent looks not too big.
So I think when you have some problems with the LF, you can tune the vent, to make the vent deeper. I would start with a vent from around 6 cm deep (make a 4 cm. deep wood frame from plywood, and put that wood frame on the inside around the vent. In the test phase you can clamp it temporary with a clamp. (during the tests you can adjust the frame by cutting it smaller and find out what works best in your situation) Succes!
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Increasing vent length lowers F3, Fb, so for all but VLF special effects and some pipe organ symphonies, tuning lower would normally only be called for if the bass was too 'boomy' which can occur with corner loading. For more bass/mid-bass 'presence' [tonal balance] then, either a larger vent that raises F3, Fb and/or some baffle step compensation [BSC] is called for which is usually the case if the speakers are well away from any wall, corner boundaries. Of course, fiddling with these or any other fine tuning adjustments should only be done once installed in-room.
As for tuning by ear, it's better than nothing, but due to the way we perceive sound it's a crapshoot unless one has perfect pitch good enough to tune a piano and why I got in the habit of getting young women to help since men tend to do better down low while women do much better through the HF, so between the two, a decent balance can normally be struck and I'm guessing why I didn't have a clue what all SAF, WAF, etc. meant/implied when I got on-line.
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Very interesting project, and beautiful workmanship. I never did see a link to the original plan? Or maybe there isn't one.
Two thoughts, both incompletely informed perhaps. The result of idle midnight thinking.
Sealing openable joints: I've thought of using ordinary Crouse Hinds (or other manufacturer.) duct seal (sometimes called Elephant Poop amongst other things) My thinking has been to run it thorough my old hand crank pasta machine with the linguini blade installed after thickness rolling. The stuff is good forever in some pretty tough industrial settings but provision would need to be made with a "pry" lip attached to the removable piece. Or maybe a screw thread against a hard spot on the support cleats to break the seal. It's pretty sticky. Drivers can be attached to the baffle using these: http://www.mcmaster.com/#threaded-inserts/=bzcrce Drill the mounting holes so they don't go through the baffle, or (if they do) back them with a piece of 1/8th ply, glued in place with some of GM's magic poly glue. Actual leaks through the driver suspension (if bad enough) might require re-doping the surround. Weber speaker might sell some speaker dope; I dunno.
Second. I've heard some good things about R-13/R/18 for internal sonic resistance and have seen it settle over time to the bottom of the box. My thinking has been to loosely tack bird netting (the black UV resistant kind) over the bats to try and hold them in place. I've heard that packing the stuffing too tight will require a larger box for the same results as loose filling but it may be worth a try.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Quote:
Originally Posted by
AltecLansingFan
I think it's track 18, 19 and 20 (I'm not really sure) There you can hear all Hz from 10Hz and up. The best is that you can hear almost NO or less volume peaks in the frequency's.
I'm not an expert, but when I look to the enclosure, the briefcase vent looks not too big.
So I think when you have some problems with the LF, you can tune the vent, to make the vent deeper. I would start with a vent from around 6 cm deep (make a 4 cm. deep wood frame from plywood, and put that wood frame on the inside around the vent. In the test phase you can clamp it temporary with a clamp. (during the tests you can adjust the frame by cutting it smaller and find out what works best in your situation) Succes!
I was thinking forward to doing that very thing, temporarily adding a plywood vent extension. At this time, my ears tell me it is not necesary. I believe the designer hit the ball on the fat of the bat, it is going over the fence!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GM
Increasing vent length lowers F3, Fb, so for all but VLF special effects and some pipe organ symphonies, tuning lower would normally only be called for if the bass was too 'boomy' which can occur with corner loading. For more bass/mid-bass 'presence' [tonal balance] then, either a larger vent that raises F3, Fb and/or some baffle step compensation [BSC] is called for which is usually the case if the speakers are well away from any wall, corner boundaries. Of course, fiddling with these or any other fine tuning adjustments should only be done once installed in-room.
As for tuning by ear, it's better than nothing, but due to the way we perceive sound it's a crapshoot unless one has perfect pitch good enough to tune a piano and why I got in the habit of getting young women to help since men tend to do better down low while women do much better through the HF, so between the two, a decent balance can normally be struck and I'm guessing why I didn't have a clue what all SAF, WAF, etc. meant/implied when I got on-line.
GM
My thoughts, too, GM, wait until I have everyting in situ. I'd sure like to have some measurement devices, at this point. I may get to a local place that stocks all of it and just plunk down the funds.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
airboss
Very interesting project, and beautiful workmanship. I never did see a link to the original plan? Or maybe there isn't one.
Two thoughts, both incompletely informed perhaps. The result of idle midnight thinking.
Sealing openable joints: I've thought of using ordinary Crouse Hinds (or other manufacturer.) duct seal (sometimes called Elephant Poop amongst other things) My thinking has been to run it thorough my old hand crank pasta machine with the linguini blade installed after thickness rolling. The stuff is good forever in some pretty tough industrial settings but provision would need to be made with a "pry" lip attached to the removable piece. Or maybe a screw thread against a hard spot on the support cleats to break the seal. It's pretty sticky. Drivers can be attached to the baffle using these:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#threaded-inserts/=bzcrce Drill the mounting holes so they don't go through the baffle, or (if they do) back them with a piece of 1/8th ply, glued in place with some of GM's magic poly glue. Actual leaks through the driver suspension (if bad enough) might require re-doping the surround. Weber speaker might sell some speaker dope; I dunno.
Second. I've heard some good things about R-13/R/18 for internal sonic resistance and have seen it settle over time to the bottom of the box. My thinking has been to loosely tack bird netting (the black UV resistant kind) over the bats to try and hold them in place. I've heard that packing the stuffing too tight will require a larger box for the same results as loose filling but it may be worth a try.
I've used duct seal to seal woofers to the cab, the Large Advebts had this as a stock sealant. I epoxied the T-nut fasteners into the inside of the baffle. I wouldn't think any air can travel through the filled T-nut. I passed through the heating/cooling section of a local lumber super-store, recently, and saw a woven filter containment material. It is close to what you have descibed, a loose weave. The purpose of the material is to hold spun filter elements when someone has to build a filter from scratch. I may remove some of the R-13 before the cabs are moved out of the shop and the additional netting sounds like a prudent idea.
I'm enjoying the heck out of these!
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Depends on the quality of the hardware, I've had them leak enough around the threads to ruin a ducted port's tuning, so some form of thread sealant is required to ensure a good seal.
Don't recall ever having any sealing problems between the baffle and t-nut, but then I've always deep seated them by either using washers and a large 'c' clamp or pulling them in with a bolt or using a proper press when available. Just whacking them in with a hammer as I've seen many DIYers do doesn't tend to seat them well, so they typically way over torque the screw to seat them well enough to keep them from falling out when removing the driver and why over time they have become a fastener to be avoided now that threaded inserts have become reasonably priced.
Right, short of needing a high enough stuffing density to require filling the whole cab which requires the back of the driver[s] and any other exposed components to be covered with cheesecloth or similar, anytime stuffing [loose fiberglass batting, polyfil or similar] is used it should always be contained in a suspended cheesecloth or similar 'bag'. This is more effective, ergo requires less stuffing than when lining the walls with it and of course de facto protects any driver[s]/components well enough.
Yes, like all things there's a point of diminishing returns and if too dense a stuffing is used, then it goes from acoustically increasing the cab's effective acoustic volume [Vb], raising F3/lowering Fb and begins decreasing it, raising F3, Fb: http://web.archive.org/web/200210070...ces/fiberfill/
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
GM, I'll certainly add some pipe dope to the machine screws that fasten the woofer to the baffle. That is easy and prudent. I have the T-nuts epoxied into the holes that accept them and I sized the holes to be a very tight fit. I'm not going to lose any sleep over air getting around the body of the T-nut.
I'm still on the fence about removing stuffing or leaving everything as-is. Since I haven't contained the fiberglass, yet, now would be the time to play with that. My reading on stuffing yielded that fiberglass is superior to fiberfill due to the length of fibers. Lambs wool being superior to both, again, because of length of the fibers. Am I on the right track about that?
Since these cabs are so big and I met some resistance from Her Majesty about placement in the "Throne Room", I've placated the situation by taking on a trim job around three windows in the Palace. These windows are directly behind where I plan to locate the speakers so I am now a little bit of time away from final placement. Not too much of a dissapointment because we have a pretty nice shop system going.:cool:
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Correct about the stuffing. Again, assuming you're not trying to damp down a seriously under-damped alignment [you're not], then the 'name of the game' is to have just enough stuffing for the driver to make a sharp 'click', though if you have keen/experienced enough hearing, a well recorded kick drum or even bass guitar will suffice. The best way of course is do an impulse response test or so goes conventional wisdom...........
I forget what you did now, but a number of the larger Altec MLTLs where I got feedback didn't bother with any testing other than known music and wound up pulling out much of what I recommended based on actual testing, with usually just a pad covering most of the top, one side beside the driver and one behind it on the back cover, ~the same way Altec did with some of their designs.
One man with a 515B in ~27 ft^3 MLTL IIRC and driven with a matching impedance amp ripped it all out before he was happy. Apparently the amp's ~DF = 1 combined with the cab's 'ringing' matched up well enough to 'color' the signal at the listening position just the right amount to inject the 'richness' of a live event that the recording studio process filters out, especially those on CD.
So if yours is lined all the way to the bottom, I'd just remove all of it below the halfway point and if more needs to be removed, cut off the tops and sides of what's left before trying to thin it out since this will somewhat destroy its structural/damping integrity.
Just so long as those windows have some nice heavy drapes you can pull shut to damp all those reflections.
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
I have the cabinet covered on the back side down 16" from the top, as are the sides. The top is also covered, all of this with 3 1/2" fiberglass R13, density 1 lb./cu.ft. (as nearly as I can surmise from the sources I've read).
I am driving the 416b with a JBL/UREI 6290, 300w.@8 ohms, damping rated at +200. The response is very good, it's definitely digging low but I think I can get it a little more lively than I have it by removing some stuffing.
For some reason I abandoned the toggle "clicker" device. I'll try that out tonight. Drapes are sure to be hung, along with some type of shade. Her Highness has a thing about daylight in the Palace.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Hmm, knowing how R19 performs, it's interesting that it doesn't sound hollow with it just down to the bottom of the driver. Then again, the sim shows a near critically damped alignment with no damping, something I don't normally look at, so consider just pulling it all out and suspending strips of it diagonally across the top and either anchored or weighted at its bottom. This will damp both planes with a much reduced stuffing density and if it still doesn't sound 'boomy', then try something even more acoustically transparent.
I've got a sneaking suspicion that just some on the top to quell the TL's harmonics and loosely covering the back of the driver with coarse muslin or cheesecloth/insulation like was once common with I.B. installs may suffice, so you may want to try this after removing it from the sides/back [fig. 5b]: http://www.lansingheritage.org/image...ign/page08.jpg
As for Her Highness's lighting preferences, I'm not touching that one with a '10 ft pole'!
GM
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
Thanks, GM.
I reassembled a "clicker" as per the schematic you linked to back in a past post in this thread. Results were a very accurate, amplified, click without any boom or veil of the sound.
I will remove insulation in the cabinet when I am able to access the bottom hatches, more readily, when the cabinets are on carpet. I hate to tip them over when situated on a concrete floor, accidental dropping or scratches can be avoided.
I am still enjoying the new TL sound of these and I believe with some minor stuffing tweaks and better matched amplification, it can only get better. Visitors of differing levels of listening experience have all reported with positive compliments, even removing the social-biasing, their reinforcement of a positive experience is approval of the design.
I am comfrotable with the size of these as I have the space and proclivity to not be bothered by large speakers. Others are not so acceptable to their size. Is there an alternative in your MLTL designs to enable a similar alignment? Just curious because the reproduction from the 416b is so enjoyable and others may wish to hear what a TL cabinet can do without having the larger cabinets.
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Re: GM's MLTL with 416-8B
You're welcome!
Understood, I've still got five different size commercial plush [super dense] carpet remnants for just such occasions. Turn the big one face down and it makes a great 'towing sled' to drag big/heavy ones around.
Yes, and no. I mean you can shrink the cab's CSA and actually get a more perceived 'tightness'/'snap', but it's because there's much less bass output to balance it out even though it's tuned the same, i.e. has a higher F3, so ideally it would be corner loaded. This is the 'secret' to Pi Speaker's PiAlign, it's an old prosound design routine based on W.E.'s original reflex alignment he resurrected/claimed for his own. For low output impedance systems, the PiAlign is preferred, but for higher output impedance the original is preferred since it de facto requires a [ideally] measured Fs tuning.
Anyway, I've designed/built far more skinny 'tower'/'column' alignments [aka ML-TL, ML-TQWT, ML-horn as well as the various 'Classic' pure TLs] than deep bass capable ones for one reason or another, including Altec loaded, so very familiar with all of them.
Anyway, shrinking yours to be only big enough to mount an 811 on top reduces it to 18.75" o.d. wide x 17.25" deep o.d. or ~7.55 ft^3 net which has much less bass output and due to the smaller net Vb the vent now needs to be 5" long. It's also acoustically too high an aspect ratio, so stuffing density doubles to 0.5 lbs/ft^3 to get a similar response smoothness:
GM
